The Morning Call now has an article on the concerns about the Intermediate School raised at the School Board meeting on Monday (read the article here).
Not much new in this article, compared to the earlier one.
One item of interest is that the article quotes Dr. Lesky as stating the goal is to shorten the day to 3:00 p.m. bell next year. It also notes that the day was lengthened because the Nazareth elementary school day was the shortest allowed by state law, and the additional time was included to provide enrichment and targeted instruction to students.
I don’t have a problem with the length of day as much as I have the transportation logistics, which appear to make it longer than necessary. I do have a problem with saying the time was for education when we are spending so much time distracting our teachers from teaching. A few weeks back on homecoming weekend the kids watched a feature movie (2 hours or so). This week there are a myriad of non-educational activities. Earlier this month teachers and students were polled and discussed whether or not to have a parade. And then there is all the pre-testing that takes place in order to teach to the pssa test, which in itself is not teaching the kids anything.
I think the biggest complaint ought to be a curriculum based around the pssa test instead of simply developing a solid curriculum that would allow students to perform well when they are forced to take it.
Thoughts?
18 comments:
Kelley became Sally in the article...but that's ok
hey heard (not confirmed just heard) today that desks are being transferred from the elementary schools to the IS---better late than never
I am glad the district is listening some but I take exception to the comment that we need to be patient as it is only 6 weeks into the school year, did they not know the new school was coming for two years?
Kelley, I think you answered your own question. Planning is not a strong suit of this administration.
I take more notice of NOCs comment about the PSSA test prep. This has become and issue, and it seems to be more important than actual education.
Parents have become more concerned that our scores be better than other schools and less focused on the core skills.
We need to take the emphasis off of these tests and more on core course work.
ranter-
don't the PSSA's test the core course work?
i guess i believe that the PDE is deciding what the cores should be, making tests that evaluate a student's understanding of them and if teachers teach the "core course work" as you put it then they should do fine on the tests... am i missing smething?
if we don't like the pssa's isn't the pde who you take it up with not your school district?
I've mentioned this before, the PSSA test is used to judge the district as a whole, not the student as an individual.
When scores are low, it is assumed the kids aren't taking them seriously, so now NASD uses the PSSA to judge individual students.
The test is not a problem. The problem is the school's reaction to the test. The core focus is to pre-test, teach to the test, and test again. We've spent a lot of money on programs that provide the screening tests and we've taken alot of time out of the school year to implement.
We have also changed our curriculum based on the test and continue to do so.
It is my understanding that Trig is being phased out because it is not on the PSSA test.
Again, it is not the test, but how our district has decided to approach it.
Kelly-
What you are missing is that PSSA's do not equal SAT's. Not even close.
If your children do not plan on going to college, you have no issues. If they do, you should worry.
The college admissions procedure looks at a student's SAT scores, not PSSA's. Do you know the average SAT score for Nazareth? I hear most people in the district constantly recite our PSSA scores, but never SAT....funny...does anyone ever ask?
I was attended a college tour over the summer for Bloomsburg University and the admissions officer announced that they receive approximately 12,000 applications and accept around 2000. 2000!! She recommended that students do all they can to make their application stand out (i.e. do NOT just take the minimum requirements in high school, take as many AP courses as you can, take MORE than 2 years of a language, etc...).
Due to our block scheduling...this is VERY difficult...our students simply cannot fit many of these classes in, some are just not offered.
NASD now has removed Trigonometry from their curriculum as a stand alone class. Trig IS on the SAT. A friend of mine is a guidance counselor in another district and was appalled when I told her that.
Take a hard look at the HIGH SCHOOL CURRICULUM...it is NOT robust enough to give our students the best competitive advantage when they need it most.
There is PSSA prep time allocated during the school day...what about SAT prep? Even after school...SAT prep? NONE!
PSSA's do not equal SAT's and the colleges do not care about PSSA's.
Kelley,
Just to make this clear, the PSSA is the report card for teachers and the administration, NOT the students. They, especially the administration, have figured out a way to make the PSSA a part of the students grade by using the pre-test work and study materials part of their grade.
We are preparing our kids to take the PSSA, not preparing them for college, period.
A clear indication of this is the large percentage of kids that start at NCC versus a brand name university. Some of this may be for economic reasons, but knowing the system, the majority are probably because they don't have the resume needed to compete at those schools.
We have gotten into this "our PSSA scores are better than yours" mentality and have lost sight of what is really important.
Amused is correct, more people can recite our PSSA scores than know the average SAT scores of our HS students.
If you don't plan on sending your kids to college, no problems. But, if you do, big problems.
This is all an unintended effect of No Child Left Behind. No Child Left Behind is an attempt to improve upon the high number of 'graduating' high school seniors in our country who still could not read and/or lacked basic math skills. Many kids were just being shuffled through the system with social promotion.
The PSSA's are the government's method of holding our districts accountable for the lowest denominator in the equation.
Unfortunately, the students who are paying the price are those that do perform well in school. Advanced coursework has been cut everywhere. Students are forced to spend a great deal of time in school practicing this test whether they need it or not in order to bring the rest up to speed. The government is not judging your school district based on how well they are prepared for college....they only care about the number of students who can meet the 'basic' requirements for reading, writing, and math. Critical thinking is no longer important in our public school system.
No Child Left Behind is in fact leaving many students behind.
Did some quick SAT research, and per the PA Dept. of Education site, here are some average SAT scores for the 2009 testing cycle:
Nazareth 1020
Freedom 995
Liberty 978
Saucon 1040
Parkland 1081
Easton 970
Southern Lehigh 1086
Dieruff 883
Allen 910
Note that Southern Lehigh with the highest average SAT score is also the only district WITHOUT block scheduling.
Checking on Bloomsburg (referenced in earlier post), they are looking for a 1080 SAT score, meaning that only Parkland and SoLehigh are the only two in the range to meet that criteria.
For the rest of us, it comes down to those "extras" that will augment an application where the SAT score falls below the basic level they are looking for. Those AP courses, the deeper courses beyond the basics required.
Yes, our average SAT score isn't bad, but with a lack of AP courses and being hamstrung by the block scheduling, and now the stronger emphasis on the PSSA, our kids are having the deck stacked against them.
All of the ES, IS and MS parents should be screaming about what are we doing to bring up the SAT scores, and more important, what is being done to improve the transcripts of our kids to make them more competitive at universities.
Not worrying if our PSSA scores are better than the other districts.
Having a quality school is the goal and the PSSA is the current measurement. Not to say it is correct, but that is what we have.
SAT have been and continue to be how colleges mostly judge students academic achievement, because grades fluctuate to such a great extent from school to school.
Comparing an average SAT score though, does not denote the quality of the school, because it is elective and does not represent the entire school population.
As noted earlier, SATs, class rank, AP courses, and activities are important for students to gain entrance to college.
Bloom is a state university and a part of their mission is to help resident students get a quality education. As such they are competitive, but not as much as private schools or attending another state's university (ie a PA resident applying to attend University of North Carolina will have a harder time getting in than a NC student).
I agree we need to dump block scheduling immediately and start looking out for the students' best interest and not the school administrators "reputation".
NOC,
I will differ with you regarding the SAT being a measurement. If your kids plan on going to college, then it is most certainly an indicator of how good your district is.
Hanover and Asa Packer ES in BASD continuously have almost the entire school ranked in "advanced" (a statistical improbability, but I digress). But, look at the SAT scores Liberty and Freedom are posting. Not very good.
The PSSA is black and white. There is a right answer and a bunch of wrong ones. On the SAT, there are serious shades of gray, and multiple answers could be right, but there is one that is more right than the others.
This is where critical thinking comes into play, and something they are failing to teach in NASD, as well as other districts.
We are seeing a downward trend in SAT scores, starting with an average of 1053 (the high point) in 2001 down to 1020 (the lowest point) in 2009.
Meanwhile, the universities have been trending upwards in their SAT score requirements.
So, while we might be improving our PSSA scores, and everyone is SO concerned about them, on the back end, we are slowly eroding our kids chances to get into the university of their choice.
Kelley, while 16% sounds great, put that into perspective. Out of 100 kids, 16 get accepted, but 84 don't. Do you want your kid to be one of the 16 or one of the 84?
NASD in its current direction will make sure they are one of the 84.
Just a couple of things I wanted to comment on. There is no Trig on the SAT. Number and operations; algebra and functions; geometry; statistics, probability, and data analysis are the things that are measured. If your child takes the SAT subject tests, required for more competitive admissions,then the will be tested on Trig, but most likely will be in an advanced math track so will have already covered those concepts. Trig is now a part of Pre-Calc. My son, an eleventh grader is currently enrolled in Pre-Calc.
We're probably splitting hairs a bit, but I'll agree it is an indicator.
Did the stats happen to mention what percentage of the students in a grade took the SAT? If the percent were high you could then say they are doing a good job, but if only 20% of Nazareth students took it and 50% of Liberty students did, it really wouldn't tell us that much.
I wonder what percent of our students go to a 4 year private, 4 year out of state public, 4 year in state public, or 2 year school, trade school, or otherwise after graduation?
Those stats would probably be a pretty good indicator to compare with.
Was there a stat out that 50% of students going to college from Nazareth attend community college? I thought I had heard or read that at some point.
I also recall hearing a stastic quoted that 50% of Nazareth Grads attend NACC. Were they full time students? Both of my college age kids are considered NACC students since they have each taken one or more classes there in the summer as transfer courses, even though they are full time students at other Universities.
wanted to throw in something here--not about pssa but is a curriculum comment
my IS student who has pretty much always come home with 4's, or E's or 100% (depending on the grading used) is now learning to work to get that 4...and has had a 3 here and there this year...3's are 100% but extension questions answered correctly, which requires analytical thinking, or going above and beyond, is how you get the 4...I am pleased because at her age she needs to be challenged before she gets complacent...don't know if credit goes to mr roth, assuming it does, but i am very pleased to see they upped the bar at the IS and hope they have done it at all grade levels
NOC,
Now you are talking about how we should measure the district. If you care about higher education and plan on you child taking advantage of it, then those statistics are what should matter to you, not the PSSA.
The percentage of students that are getting accepted to 4 year schools, both state and private, is a very telling number.
It has become extremely competitive to get into the university of your choice these days, and they best way to get there is not just graduating, but going above and beyond what is required.
There are minimum requirements to get accepted, but after talking to a bunch of college admissions offices, that is just not enough. You have to have a much deeper resume of course work (AP and Honors classes), and well beyond the minimum number of years for others.
SATs are a good starting measure as they will indicate if kids are able to function at college level thinking. The PSSA does not do that, nor was it meant to. Tie the SAT scores together with rates of students getting accepted to four year schools (immediately after graduation, not after a stopover at NCC), and you start to get a picture of how our district stacks up to other districts.
Kelley, hope you are correct and understand what we are talking about, but I am here to tell you that at the MS and HS, you don't see true critical analysis requirements until you get into the AP courses, and that is not until Junior and Senior years.
Just to be clear by what I mean by that, if you ask a child what a fireman does, if they answer "fight fires" they are right, but there is a much deeper answer than that. They have to understand what type of fire it is, the best way to fight it, how to approach it, how to contain it, etc. That is the type of detailed analytical thinking a kid is going to need in order to be successful when they hit the college campus.
More of a breakdown from the PA Dept. of Education as to where are graduates are going. The latest data is based on the class of 2008:
Community college in PA - 133
Private 2 year college in PA - 2
State university in PA - 64
State related Commonwealth Univ. in PA - 37
Private 4 year school in PA - 42
Other post secondary school - 9
2 year college not in PA - 3
4 year college not in PA - 53
Other post secondary not in PA - 6
Homemaker - 1
Military - 5
Blue collar worker - 15
Service worker - 8
unemployed - 10
unknown - 1
What amazes me is the numbers are very similar for surrounding districts as well.
The large volume of community college students has reversed itself from when I graduated 20+ years ago with roughly the same number of students going to CC as are going to 4 year schools.
I am sure there are some economics involved, but, one has to question why such a large number of students are going to CC directly out of HS. Is it that they just don't have the depth of what is now required to get accepted into a 4 year school? From what I have seen in the HS, I believe it to be the case.
But hey, we sure are focused on those PSSA scores.
ranter- Thanks for explaining analytical thinking....
ps and fyi are and our are not interchangeable
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